thanatopathia.... Re: Pluto in the 1st House  16-Jan-98

I am born 11/29/58, 3.19 am mst. When pluto was transiting my first house I nearly died in a motorcycle accident. I am starting to get into midpoint astrology because it didn't make any close connections with anything obvious. Currently it is in my second house and I have not experienced any shifts of finances, but I have a pluto-venus square, so my finances do not, as such, usually exist. I am in the same boat that I have been in the last 15 years financially. For those of you with a neptune-pluto conjunct in transit, I haven't looked at your charts yet, but those with late Libra or Scorp ASC and those born the 29(Neptune's day) will have the regeneration of self in a physical or personal form so I se why pregnancy would occur even if the 5th house is only incidentally involved.

thanatopathia
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northwind.... Re: Pluto in the 1st House  16-Jan-98

While PLUTO was transiting back & forth from my daughter's SCORP 25 Asc.& 12th,she had a 2 & a half yr.OBSESSIVE relationship with a man 20yrs.older.Marriage plans were off & on.She was intimidated & he tried to rule her every move.She did become BaHai then & that eventually helped her sort out & let go of this bad relationship.As soon as she finally chucked this guy for good,she met a wonderful,loving guy her own age. They married when PLUTO was 2deg.past her Asc. They've been married over 4 yrs now & doing wonderfully.Thank goodness for what Plutonian energies can get rid of.  Her life has been totally transformed on all levels. Pluto in SAG.has seen her finally get into her education.She is almost 27 & a Junior in college now. She has SAG.with Jupiter/Neptune conj.in her first house. She had to get through her Scorpio Asc.first...
northwind

northwind
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 mermaid.... Re: Pluto in the 5th House  10-Dec-97

Greetngs to those in Pluto’s Realm…a while back I said that I would post in my observations on how a Pluto transit has affected me..(and which were posted in Dory’s string "Pluto Transit Caf�" back in May of this year).. I have finally managed to located the ~thoughts~ and so will copy them in…

"" In studying my Pluto transiting 5th conjunct Natal Chiron in 5th  over the last weeks I have learnt so much about myself (certainly has been a rapid learning curve) so thought would first of all post some generalised thoughts on transits first. Then I went back to my own natal chart for Pluto (1st) (Leo) and Chiron (5th)(Sag) to understand that better and to see then what the transits were activating for me in my quest for learning and "becoming"...

 Planets in an individuals birth chart represent a frozen instant in time there will not be another instant exactly the same. The chart holds the planets still for us so that we can absorb the meaning of that instant, but as we are doing so we are living through an ever-changing series of more "instants". While we are studying the still picture of the chart, the planets themselves continue on their way - the gods do not rest - neither does the individual represented by the chart.

People Evolve - they hange, grow up, have new experiences.  Transits ‘change’ implies a dynamic.  It implies that people are not static but that they are, in fact, in the process of "becoming".  Psychologist Abraham Mallow held the opinion that the term "human being" gave too much of an impression that the individual was as he/she was, as if a finished product. The term "human becoming" better conveys sense of the dynamic process which more truly characterises a person’s life.

Every day in the average life there are many opportunities to learn, and from learning, to change. Not all lessons lead to growth (e.g. an individual whose faith in his/her spouse is justifiably shattered may adopt an attitude of mistrust towards him/her, or may generalise his/her nature and decide that all men/women are untrustworthy - it is his/her choice). The point is the experiences of life bring new realisations, new understandings and perceptions, and from these new attitudes.  Hopefully the new attitudes are an improvement but they are not always so.

I will first put down what I have learnt (or re-learnt) over the past weeks and you will see where I am coming from when I next equate them to my own experiences which will be posted in a week or so...  So now we go back firstly to that natal Pluto in the 1st which equates to Freedom, independence, personal discoveries. ie Pluto in any angular sign shows that a new evolutionary cycle is beginning.  There is an emphasised need for freedom and independence, compulsive intense sense of personal discovery and must be free enough to pursue whatever experience comes their way. Polarity point is 7th house i.e. process of self discovery cannot occur by maintaining primary allegiance to self, therefore 1st house can manifest as a desire to initiate relationships with other who can help the individual answer the question "who am I" and "what am I". Prior life instinctual impulse promotes a "natural loner" coming into this life. Can promote identity crisis because have reached an evolutionary limitation that is rooted in themselves.

Pluto transiting 5th
Archetype of 5th house evolutionary process is to induce an inner and outer situation through which the individual progressively learns to take charge of his/her own reality and to recreate that reality in order to reflect and establish the new creative impulses that are emerging from the depths of the soul. These new creative impulses will be directly linked to the very purpose of the individuals life.  The process will also necessitate that the individual examines the basis of why and how he/she has been giving to other people. If will also be necessary to examine the basis of the personal need to receive love and attention from others and to be considered important and special.  This process will promote a regeneration of personal creativity.  Deep inner emotional surges of creative inspiration, feelings and desires will spear the individual to take charge of his/her own destiny and personal reality. The effect will be to re-create personal reality in order to accommodate, apply and express these creative urges. The very purpose for the individuals existence will be re-formulated as a result.

Chiron - in Natal 5th  Chiron’s house position shows where we are carrying wounds that are bigger than our lifetime and healing can come when you are strong enough to lay that burden down, hand over to a higher source, knowing that although it may be unfixable at one level, the continuing struggle is only getting in the way.

5th House /Sagittarius deals with Expanding mental and philosophical horizons. Chiron as ruler of Sagittarius needs to reach peace with "being" rather than "doing" - knowing what we came here for. Chirons story is about giving up the attachment to our suffering. You can’t finish it and start something else but you can step out of being wholly identified with it.  Parents might be foreigners. Jung believed that the religious instinct and the search for meaning and right connection with the gods was a natural human drive. We might suffer therefore because of a sense of vision and possibility and finding a suitable direction in life.  Arrows in intuition fly everywhere but can be dismayed to discover that things do not happen by themselves and feel reluctant to take active steps to make things happen.

Like Chiron, we might be "shot down" by others, the balloon of our enthusiasm and over extension of ourselves may be pricked many times before we can accept the gap between what can be made to happen and what cannot.  It may cost us great pain to let go of a vision or hope, and if our sense of individuality and identity is bound up with it, we would then feel as though we were "dying". However, with this placement, life often brings such a crisis. If we can let go, we discover than not only does our vision remain alive, but we are in a healthier relationship with it, not driven by an identity with it.
Chiron/Pluto Aspects (Natal Pluto Trine Chiron - Transiting Pluto conjunct Chiron).  Consciously acknowledging power issues and putting them into appropriate perspective is important with Chiron/Pluto aspects.  Often have great emotional depths and penetrating insight in others.  Once able to encompass their own emotional wounds they are capable of great loyalty in relationships as they see and accept the very worst in themselves and others.  Initiates transformation through acceptance of "what is" at the deepest level.

With maturity Chiron/Pluto can feel the peace and confidence which comes from having faced a great deal of emotional pain.  Once have comes to terms with the destructive potential of this aspect C/P people are often able to channel powerful healing to others. Can also trigger channelling and divination powers.  C/P experience is of life and death as two sides of one process : it reminds us that in the end we have only our own souls to answer to, and that the will of the unfolding universe works through us, with or without or conscious participation.

The intuitive sense is usually correct. The C/P journey involves re-connecting with and learning to trust those deep instincts. Have an uncanny sense of self preservation, can sense trouble and therefore have a knack of avoiding disaster and an ability to react instinctively and creatively to danger. Pluto shows that we cannot even begin to align with Chiron until we have first done the hard work of depth clearing and we can’t make it through the depth clearing without the vision of the higher self.  So as we enter depth clearing, at first we use our intuition as a guide then once we have learnt to trust our intuition, we will find a divination skill which will attune us to the collective.  Then finally we will begin to identify the hologram of the individual soul within the larger hologram and then let go of the little self.  Aspects between Pluto and Chiron will yield many clues on how to clear the self in attunement with the vision of the higher self.
The above is with assistance from and thanks to Jeff Green, Stephen Forrest and Melanie Reinhart who have helped to really open and focus my mind on the path to "the higher self".... The next instalment will show how I believe I am finally now beginning to work through these transits on a personal level.....

mermaid
email: thought waves

(continued)  10-Dec-97

One is right in saying that in order to gain a better understanding of Pluto transits we HAVE to have the understanding of what Pluto is trying to show us in our natal charts. It was only when I researched the Jeff Green book and REALLY began to understand my 1st house Pluto (thanks to Dory’s observations on my chart) that I could start to go forward with the 5th house transit (which has now been going on for the past 4 years) as was just going round in circles with Mr Hand trying to understand but not getting anywhere as I hadn’t really looked at that natal positon.  Also we have to understand the natal position of whatever planet is in the house that Pluto is transiting ie my Chiron in the 5th - remembering the house represents the field of experience where the energies will be most diretly encountered and the Aspects reveal the dynamism and intensity of experience...  I said when I posted my "research" that I would come with equating that with how I am now helping myself to work through these and so here goes...

Firstly if we take our friend Rob Hand and what he has to say on the 5th house transits - in summary as I believe that most of us are familiar with what he says:

"The impact of this transit can have many consequences, because the 5th house rules several areas of your life. Relating on one hand to re-creation and amusement in the literal sense of the word (creative self expression, art and other forms of recreation) and the other to children, who are a re-creation of the self. - and also to love affairs."
Firstly lets take natal Pluto in 1st with polarity point in 7th.... i.e.  process of self discovery cannot occur by maintaining primary allegiance to self, therefore 1st house can manifest as a desire to initiate relationships with other who can help the individual answer the question "who am I" and "what am I".  Then take natal Chiron in 5th and what it represents:

Wounded/Wounder/Healer Part 2
So how to work through Pluto in 5th ?  Fated Love Affair ? 4 years ago last Christmas a very powerful charismatic Scorpio walked into my kitchen..... started telephoning me.... could link to him telepathically... caused great confusion.... he got resisted.. took off (literally as he is an Eagle in the sense of being a pilot) .. for a year... came back... took off.. etc etc It would have been so easy to have said to myself "to heck with it - off I go -"heaven here I come!..", remembering that I have had relationships with Scorpios before......... and yes they have been wonderful... BUT something said "wait a minute...." And that was my "gut" intuition not astrology as I hadn’t gone back into astrology then...

In my search through life I have been lucky to have had a few "great love affairs" - I have helped my lovers through their own problems, with a lot of hurting myself in the process, then left with them saying what a better person I have made them and how they understand women so much better ... so the next lucky woman always got the benefit!!! Here is the Wounded Healer..... who fortunately did not turn  into the WOUNDER/Healer.... just carried onto the next..... 5th house looking for the 7th- I do add here that I am also lucky that my ex’s  have always stayed friends....  I therefore do not honestly believe that this transit is for me with a fated love affair... not this time... Children ?

I don’t have children of my own therefore I couldn’t change through that but I do have two grownup stepchildren and most of us might remember that my stepsone had the terrible accident in Australia falling off a 4th floor balcony - and it was life threatening... (Fortunately he has made a wonderful, miraculous recovery and as I type this he is in the air now flying home and due back tomorrow) That situation however did make me get on the Net (only to be able to have an e-mail address to e-mail the hospital - didn’t have a clue of how to use the wretched thing!) and within two days I had stumbled across AC which (as dear MickM told me then that I had and still have transiting Uranus/Mercury) suddenly activated my interest in astrology on a much deeper phsychological level.... (fated through children - maybe doesn’t have to be your own in this case)...

also with D/Heart and Dory showing that Pluto was sitting on top of Chiron (thereby activating those issues)... I still cannot believe the Rapid Learning Curve and tranformation I have gone (and am still going) through.....  Creative self-expression ?
We now have the "regeneration ofpersonal creativity"..... Some of my friends here know of my 10 years of "loneliness" (not of living in solitary confinement) being with someone who has no idea of my real inner being, does not believe in life after death, has no concept of metaphysics - therefore the loneliness was in communication with people who I can relate to on a "being" and "thinking" plane.

I have now started to write after encouragement from friends here which is a start to that "creative" self expression which has been suppressed for a long time. But really one has to appreciate the "loneliness" in order to appreciate the reverse. How can one really feel "happiness" unless one has experienced the depths of sorrow..... I truly believe everything and  everyone we meet in this physical life (the ups and downs, highs and lows etc) is a lesson to be learnt in order to go foward on our soul journey and at long last I am learning to walk WITH Pluto now rather than letting him TAKE me for a walk....   I believe I am learning to lay down the wound and can now help to heal..... both myself and others who may need help along their own soul journey.... The Lord of the Underworld and the Horseman have now shown me the way forward - they were always trying to show me but I just couldn’t (wouldn’t) see .........""" 16th May 97
As t/Pluto is coming round again to conjunct my natal chiron (0 30+) and is currently Square N/Sun (separating) Sextile Mercury (0 11+),  Semisquare Jupiter (0 45-)and Trine Asc (0 58-), it will be interesting o see how the learning process manifests further…{smile}…  I hope you enjoyed…

love from

mermaid
email: thought waves

(The title of the Robert Hand book quoted above is "Planets In Transit".
 Click this link to go to Amazon.Com Bookstore - Ed)

(The following three posts are replies to a question posted by Nagakanya at the Astro-Chat forums.  She asked about becoming pregnant during a Pluto transit to her 5th house.  She has natal Saturn in the 5th.  Date is 26-Jul-98.

She said: "Hi everyone. Elsewhere you have heard me bewailing the fact that I've been trying unsuccessfully to get pregnant for the past two years, due in part (I'm sure) to having Saturn in my fifth house. Your responses have been a great comfort to me. My question is this: This year (and next) Pluto is passing through my fifth house and will conjunct my natal Saturn sometime next spring. I've read that Pluto governs reproduction and that pregnancies do occur when Pluto is transiting natal planets in the fifth house. Any comments?"

Below are three of the replies answering the query.)
 

astro73.... Re: Pluto in the 5th house  27-Jul-98

 Hi nagakanya, This one is out of my depth (scorpio punn)! But it sounds very credible you will be pregnant. Perhaps there is some tauma in your subconscious that prevents you from having a child it could be past life or present life. If that last statement does not agree with your beliefs ignore it. Do you dream? If so before dropping off to bed you could ask the reason why you have not become pregnant though you are probably trying very hard. Pluto will dredge the subconscious of saturns influence when it transits so you could help it along by considering an alternative therapy. I've heard it said that a past life issue can cause a person or couple to be unable to conceive, though this does not mean it cannot be healed- see "Cutting the ties that bind"-Phyllis Krystal.

Slan

DB

astro73
Email: [email protected]
 

Pele.... Re: Pluto transiting 5th house  29-Jul-98

 Hi,nagakanya, and astro73 - I just read the posts, and having Saturn in fifth house myself, with Pluto about to enter the fifth, I felt compelled to answer.

Pluto will spur your creativity in some way while transiting the fifth house, and yes, it is likely that you'll become pregnant in that time. If that's what you want. However, Pluto will also want to unearth whatever issues you have around becoming pregnant - especially when it conjuncts Saturn. (Which I'm also in the process of experiencing.)

Saturn in fifth alone will not be enough to prevent pregnancy. There would have to be some other supporting aspects - such as Chiron in sixth - or things like that - that would make it difficult.

Unless you have an eensy weensy fifth house, Pluto is likely to transit it for longer than a year and a half, too - so sit back, and enjoy the ride.

Pele
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will.... Re: Pluto in the 5th house  30-Jul-98

 What a darned interesting question !!

I personally don't go with the 5th house as fertility, I still think that is in the 4th house. I do agree with Pele about the "real" meaning of the Pluto transit too. Examining the ISSUES around children and self-expression ... Some serious deep though here. I suggest that your question Nagakanya is part of the Pluto theme. You are _asking_ the kinds of Pluto questions I would expect.

I can see a lot of fantasy and dreams and wishes about the ideal of Children here too. Venus in the 12th house; ruling the 4th AND 11th houses. Perhaps you feel that a child will become your friend for life, the ultimate Relationship ?

You are very much an Individual, with a sense of freedom and responsibility. Are you prepared for the inner turmoil, the dilemma, you would face with a child ? There seem from the chart to be issues here between your dreams and expectations against the really deep emotionally kept tennants you hold dear concerning your self-expression.

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